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I believe men and women do get treated differently in the workplace. I can’t speak so much on evaluation but I can speak towards teaching and parents.

I teach with a male teacher and sometimes the way he talks to the students makes me cringe a little. However, he rarely gets called to the office about it, parents rarely call to complain, etc. If I do something as simple as confiscating a cell phone outside at recess, I will inevidably get a phone call from the parent after school where they let me know they will also be calling to speak to the principal about the matter and then I get called into the prinicpals office for a chat (even though I’m just following school procedure). If the same thing happened to him, the parents would do nothing or, at most, call him. He has no trouble getting the parents to “like” him, especially the mothers, even though he often treats their children with little respect in class.

The prinicpal also treats him differently. He gets away with breaking the rules a lot more than female teachers. If he forgets a duty, that’s okay. If he doesn’t complete paperwork on time, it’s okay because he probably didn’t know it needed to be done. In many instances, she treats him like a son, instead of like a professional.

I know that the parents in my school community think I am too hard on the students because I have high expectations for them, but I treat my students fairly and consistently and I think my students appreciate that (or so it would seem from my conversations and relationships with them). My colleague, however, gets more respect from the parents than I do but not as much from the students.

In this day and age you would think that this double standard would be pretty much gone, but in my personal experience it is still prevalent.

Although I do respect your opinion in this matter it seems to me that you are making a hasty generalization about one incident or person. I wonder if this is the case with the whole staff or just one person. I think this could be reversed in many schools. How often do we hear about preferential treatment within work places from either side of the spectrum? Within schools there seems to be a gender gape between both male teacher and female teachers and male students and female students. I think that this goes back to grade school. It seems that for the most part school favors females (historically the way that they are set up) according to many theorists. As where young males are more hyper and social than that of young females. I think that this translates to the work place when they are older. I think that questions is, which is more important the process or the outcome. Is it wise for humans to compare their relationships to that of another? I have seen many females who possess greater skill than any man they come across in both life and leisure. I think that the key is and will always be building relationships with those around us. Moreover, part of building relationships is knowing when to follow the rules to a T, or when to perhaps deal with situations through feeling it out. The most important thing in our job is to feel like we are backed up on our decisions. Perhaps talking to your principal about the lack of support you receive or feel you receive is better than being upset about the over support your co-worker receives. Hope this helps.

I agree! I have seen favouritism among staff as well. I too have a male teaching partner who makes me cringe sometimes when he talks to the kids. He speaks very harshly to staff as well and they simply say oh its just ___. I don’t understand why this is the case. If we are all maintain the same level of accountability, we should be more successful as a school. I often wonder about how we (females) treat our female administrators compared to our male administrators a s well. I think that generally, we are hypocritical in the way that we perceive female administrators as well. Correct me if I am wrong, but I think that once you become an administrator and you are female, you have to add a degree of firmness in order to demand the respect of the female staff.

I find this observation very interesting because, as a female highschool teacher for many years ,I have found just the opposite – that is that the males tend to have a harder time with getting challenged by parents and admin. on rule breaking than the females. Lee, I can’t remember if you are an elementary school teacher or not,... do you think it is possible that this is more typical in one panel than in another? I know many, many male teachers that have been challenged about the way they speak to students, treat students, as well as concerns with regard to body language and inappropriate behaviours. As a matter of fact, because of these experiences, when I have male student teachers I spend a long time cautioning them on what they may get themselves in trouble for – and that includes duties, missing events like P.A. days and masses. I also find the male staff members worry more about being alone with students, certainly touching in any fashion and commenting on clothing. For example, I teach at a uniform school and most male teachers refuse to address uniform issues as they have been reprimanded too often for making comments about student’s clothing. Certainly when I started teaching many years ago I was one of about 10% of the female staff at the highschool level. You can well imagine the troubles we woman had! But in the most recent past I have been much less aware of these issues.

This discussion has taken a bit of a different turn than I had anticipated, which is great. I actually teach in the elementary panel, Mary Ellen, where there are very few male teachers, which is a whole other discussion. I was sort of looking at the question more from the point of view of Administration. When a male Administrator makes a decision that is a difficult one for whatever reason, he is often seen as tough and firm. When a female Administrator makes the same decision I would argue that the words often used to describe her are not the same and are often unkind in their intonation. I agree with Lisa as well when she speaks about how some women are often hypocritical when it comes to their female counterparts in Administration. She is quite right in stating that women Administrators have to be a certain way in order to command respect from female staff members. Why do they feel that they have to? Do some women that become Administrators become overly hard-nosed so that they aren’t seen as weaker or ineffective because they assume that’s how they will be treated? In some instances, we are our own “worst enemies.” To be less supportive serves to perpetuate the problem and make it an issue that should be a non-issue. That is not to say in any way that it is strictly a gender issue, it is much more complicated than that. It should be, as John states, all about building relationships with those around us. If only it were so simple.

I really think this is a great question. There are a few Gender books out there that talk about the same thing. How women in the work places or politics are often seen as mean or worse when they come across as strong. Where as if a man comes across as strong they are seen as just that, strong. I think that men and women will always have different choices to make when faced with hard times. What is more, it is clear that as long as men and women see each other as different we will always be different. What a great and interesting topic. I think it is very neat that we are all so passionate about how we are treated in schools by parents, staff, students, and administrators. I think what is important is, that we remember that we don’t want to let our personal bias to be felt when we become administrators. It’s often hard to remember all of the time but we are all human, with human feelings and flaws.

Lee, you have created a very interesting discussion surrounding gender roles in the school system. I would have to agree that teachers tend to support male administrators firmness much more so than females. I think we continue to expect females to be softer and gentler even when they have the administrator role. Females that have made large contributions to their position are often labelled with unkind words and their commintment to their own family questioned. As a grade one teacher, I have always been amused by the comments I hear about my teaching partner. “Oh, he’s so good with the children.” I would like to comment back, “Well, he should be seeing as he is a teacher.” I look forward to additional comments on this topic.

It is obvious that from the response this question has received—we may need to discuss further in our next session.

I overheard a conversation last week about this very topic. The individual being discussed was a female administrator. I know this individual – she is very intelligent, well spoken, assertive and she will not back down if she believes she is correct. The male who initiated the conversation said that he heard she was a “real b**”. The female responding stated that if she (the female administrator) had been a male, he would have described him as successful and just getting the job done! In much the same way – if a male leader attempts to be too much of a nurturer – he is labelled. (We haven’t come as long a way as sometimes we think we have!) I also agree with the comment by Lee about females reporting to a female. Over the years, I have witnessed women who do not like to see other women succeed. They have actually been quite cruel. I think we could spend a full day just looking at the issue of gender. We need to find ways for both men and women to celebrate and understand the differences in approaches and methods in the way each other lead. However, I will leave you with this thought – I worked with a gentleman who once said that we will have true employment equity – “when an incompetent female can keep her job as long as an incompetent male”. Something to think about . . .

Wow…your discussion is definitely a hot topic! I think you’ll get a response from all of us. For me, I have taught in two elementary schools and am currently in a middle school. I have also seen first hand how male teachers are treated differently. In the elementary schools, there was only one male teacher in one school and two male teachers in the other. They literally could do no wrong. Now, in the middle school, we have almost 50/50 ratio of men to women. Now, the males can do wrong and are called on it. But, I think it also has a alot to do with Administration. A strong leader who shows fairness towards both sexes, helps the atmosphere in the school to stay positive.

As far as Administration is concerned, I’ll be interested in our discussion, to hear if indeed female and male Administers are treated differently. I have only worked with female Principals, so my experience in this area is limited. Can’t wait for the discussion.

Marilyn

I think it is important to make sure you are speaking the same language. John Gray, the author of “Men are From Mars, Women are from Venus” made reference to the fact that men are speaking Martian and woman are speaking Venusian. This is not the first most have heard of this concept. In fact, most who are married will notice that they may say one thing and at the other end it gets transformed into something else. No one’s brain is the same and that is to be expected. It is how we reacted to the initial words that truly cause or deflect a problem. When we encounter something that we think is not right we should stop and think about what might have been meant. Often the meaning of what is being said is the same as what is thought. However, for the time that it will save taking 5 seconds to pause and clarify wont hurt.

It continues to baffle me why we have to attach a gender or race to a personality trait. If a teacher gets called into the principal’s office then it’s because there’s an issue that needs to be addressed and not because he or she is male or female. If that was the case then all people of that gender would be the only people being called in. The equivalent happens with students that get sent to the office who state that the teacher hates me because “I’m (whatever) – black, white, etc.”. Feeling that you are being treated unfairly is legitimate but I’m really hoping it’s not because of your gender.

Now all that being said I do think that female administrators are given a rougher ride at the secondary level. The major issue being compliance by male students or teachers when a request is made by a female administrator. We males really need to put our insecurities aside and act with respect at all times.

Hi Lee,

I cannot site the research on your question but can only respond from experience. My observations are that female school leaders often must perform at a higher level that male school leaders in receiving appointments to leadership positions particularily in Secondary Schools ( as pointed out by Anthony) and in Central Office positions. However, in the last 10 years I have observed a huge shift in that more and more female school leaders are being appointed to the top position as Superintendent in New York State. This trend appears to be continuing because they have done so well. Gender has become a non issue.

Niagara

What a great topic! I think that I will take it one step further and say I have witnessed that YOUNG males seem to be treated different than young females. I have seen two teachers who are similar in their teaching styles-good but not great. They are both the same age-one is a young mom and the other is a young “hip” male. Well, the female got a lot of criticism in that she was not engaging her students, was too strict etc. The male teacher has never received a complaint and has similar teaching style. I also would agree with the image of female administrators. I have often heard people call firm female administrators “B@*” I rarely hear people saying that about male administrators. Also, being a woman administrator and a mother, people expect you to be more empathetic. I ‘m not saying that you shouldn’t be, but at times it can be a slippery slope and you have to be very cautious as it may get to the point that people are taking advantage of your empathy. Also as a female administrator, I quite often get asked how I could possibly do my job and raise children. I find that offensive as a female and have turned the question around and have asked those people if they have ever asked a male that question. Though we have come a long way, statements such as these tend to reverse the clock.

This question certainly generated a lot of discussion, which is great. The responses to the original question can actually be divided clearly along the gender line as well, which is quite remarkable. It’s interesting that most of the women who responded have had first hand experience with the matter. The men from our class who responded see that the evaluating of administrators should be based strictly on ability, which is refreshing after reading about some of your experiences. They do agree, however, that women seem to need to prove themselves in positions of leadership. Could the differences in responses and the differences in how the issue is viewed be strictly based on the fact that males and females see things, emote things and respond to things is so very different to begin with? I agree with Anthony that it is baffling that we still attach gender or race to personality traits. It should be about ones competence, ability and effectiveness. As long as there are examples of it happening, I suppose it will continue to be an issue. I would hope that the trend toward it becoming a “non-issue” continues. It was great reading all of your responses, thanks for your candor.